Who is to blame for this childs death?
 

Source

I say the father of the child.

1 year old. Why the hell would you let a 1-year old be a couple houses down?

I never let my 2-year old niece go more than a couple feet away from me, unless shes in the back where the yard is fenced, or indoors.

The vehicle the man was driving, the one-year old would not have been seen by the driver because it is high off the ground, and obviously the child wasnt tall enough to be seen.

Father, clearly.

Get a fucking tether or go inside.

One year olds don't run very fast.

Also your typical Sugarland residential street has a speed limit of 15-25 mph, depending on association rules.

A guy should be aware of children playing at the curb. No matter their height, they should be visible unless they appear instantly in the middle of the street from some kind of cover.

You live in a neighborhood, you should maintain awareness for children.

If the parent was negligent, it is a separate issue...

You should always maintain an awareness of kids. On the road, you should always maintain an awareness of motorcycles....but shit happens.
The father of this boy was an idiot. He wasn't watching that kid, because from "two or three houses down", he wouldn't have been able to see him and even if he could, he wouldn't have been able to stop him from doing anything.
Don't think one year olds are fast? Take one to a department store, put him down and turn your back, count to five and turn around....

My 82 year old dad is even slower. But getting him from the parking garage to the doctor's office is just like walking with a toddler. If you are responsible for someone's safety, be responsible. This dad wasn't and now the child is dead.

Two or three houses down!?! thats fucking unbelievable! You dont let a 1 year old kid get more than a couple feet away from you. they love to adventure and explore and obviously dont yet know the dangers of life. Thats irresponsible parenting nearly at its best...or worst...whichever.

if im ever driving through a neighborhood, the LAST thing i would expect to see (other than a group of extra terrestrial cripts having a shoot out with mole people bloods) would be an unsupervised 1 year old kid do that little drunken like waddle walk in front of my bumper.

fault=parent.

that ass hole should know better than to leave his kid two houses down. If i knew this guy i would stomp on his nuts repeatedly to make sure this fuck face never spawns again.

The father should have been watching his child.

http://www.analogstereo.com/images/o...ta_sequoia.jpg

That poor child is no taller than the bumper of this pig.

That father should not have been 2 doors down. Thats about 150 feet away.

Ask anybody from tilted weapons, the average man can cover 21' in a second. Not near close enough to help his child in an emergency.

Run the father over too. What a shithead.

Father.

If he was playing near the curb, obviously the father's fault.

Even if he was in the middle of the yard and working his way towards the street, from personal experience, I would always snag a little one if they took one or two steps in a precarious direction, yet alone made their way out into a street.

Without knowing the full story, based only on what I am reading above, the father was negligent.

Both were responsible; the father was negligent.

Ditto.

Interesting... I can see that. There are children in the area that at times are not as well watched as I think they should be. I find myself being extra careful when I know they may be out and about.

But these are older children about 4 or 5 years old I'm talking about. I still can't see being a few houses down whilst a toddler is free to roam.

But a one year old? A few houses down? Seems wrong to me.

I also think the driver of the vehicle is responsible for what he hits with it. But a one year old, I can't get past that.

Perhaps it seems wrong because it is. Like I said... I still can't see being a few houses down whilst a toddler is free to roam.

I'd agree that both are technically at fault, but the father more-so to the tenth degree. The driver should have been more careful, but most people only check if they SEE children playing and by the very likely chance he didn't see the child, he probably only checked his rear-view. Meanwhile, the father was an idiot for letting the child get even ten feet away. As Will said, get a fucking tether or get inside.

Concur.

It would be pretty easy to miss a kid who is just a little over 2 feet high if you're backing up an SUV.

The father, however, based on the above, is an idiot. My little girl is 3 years old and while she is being taught road safety, when we're near the street, she doesn't get to go more than a yard away from me.

You're so white dude! :p

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Fault? Both. The actions of both of them led to this child's death.

Should hate themselves for the rest of their lives? The father left his offspring alone in a dangerous world he couldn't handle. Idiot

The driver made a mistake. Shit happens sometimes.

A 1 year old wouldn't be over the wheel well. If you are pulling out you won't see the kid in your rear view mirror if he was close to the car.

Ustwo stop changing your avatar already!

And both are at fault. The driver should have been paying more attention. If he was driving on the road he should have been watching more than just the road, especially when in a cul-de-sac. If he was backing up then he should have done a spot check before he entered the vehicle and started to blindly back out. (yes I do one every time if I am backing up, but I also back into my parking spots to avoid have to back out when I exit).

The father is also to blame for being a fucking retard. As everyone else has stated, and I agree, who the fuck lets a 1 year old that far away?? Next to a road?!? Some people should not be parents.

Lots of people also should not be driving.

That pretty much sums it up for me.

So sad.

My thoughts exactly. Did everyone not read the owner of the Dodge hit an 18-month-old not long before? He should know full well to watch for kids.


The father, though,he's a real winner.

To rain on everyone's parade, what the fuck is the point of this thread, other than for people to throw in their hat on what an awful father the father is and how it's a good idea to look around when you know kids are playing nearby?

I see lots of holier than thou and nothing to discuss. I'm sure the father feels far worse than anyone here knows, unless someone has been unfortunate enough to lose a young child, and I'm sure the guy who ran over the kid (regardless of his culpability under any legal system) feels pretty damn bad, too. Nothing to see here...

I second this, and I think it's honestly the only standard in discussing this child's tragic death.

My perspective is unique, just like everyone else's. If I'm told specifically that I'm responsible for the safety of another Marine (or complete stranger, for that matter), there's no question that it's my priority until I'm relieved of that duty or the end of time, whichever comes first. I have no children that I've been convicted of, but if I did, you could bet the farm that I'd keep a very close eye on them, or ensure that someone I'd trust with my life was doing so, at a bare minimum. I'm not saying I know everything about parenting, but this is the theory I work off of for when my day eventually comes.

I'd imagine it's very probable that there were (mitigating?) circumstances surrounding this accident that weren't covered in the original post or the source. Barring that, though, it's just pretty tragic and irresponsible on the part of the kid's father.

Then again, this is certainly not the first case of borderline or outright negligence resulting in the death of a child in the US this week. I can't back that up with anything solid, it's just a good hunch of mine, based on the state of the world...

I agree with the "father is an idiot" point of view, and though I believe he's somewhat responsible for not checking around his vehicle before backing up, I am glad the driver wasn't charged.

If you read carefully, you'll see that the driver in the primary incident was driving a 2001 Toyota Sequoia. The article says, "Less than a month ago, the driver of a Dodge Ram struck and killed an 18-month-old..." and it's a totally separate incident with a totally separate driver. The same guy didn't hit both kids.

Just seems like a tragic accident to me. I don't really see the point in sitting in my bedroom in Orlando and deciding who is to blame.

Tragedy does not equal blameless. IMO, you don't let your one year old wander several houses a way. Seriously you have kids, would you have let them more then a few feet away from you then they were one?

It is just general discussion. Similar to the way people stand around the water cooler discussing other news items. It just doesn't get much shine as there isn't much of a chance someone will pipe up and nominate the child's dad for father of the year.

That's not the point. This child is dead and his father must now live with it. I don't care if he was negligent. Who the hell has not been negligent at one point or another in their lives? Have I had a complete handle on my own kids every second of their lives? No, I haven't and I am sure there have been instances with all three of my kids that could have gone tragically wrong, but they didn't.

I've no reason to believe he supposed that this would happen. I feel for him and the man in the car. To assign blame, to me, seems callous and disrespectful.

I simply disagree with you.

To me letting his kid wander off, knowingly or not knowingly, was wrong and his actions or inactions put his child at serious risk. This time that risk lead to tragedy. As a parent you're responsible for your child, esp a toddler. If he'd have placed the child in a bath, gone off to answer the phone and the child died I blame him then too.

My guess is both the parent and the driver will carry this for the rest of their lives. That doesn't mean there's a no fault here.

Negligent or not, the death of his son is punishment enough. Sure, I'd say the 'at fault' party here is the father, but I see no point in belaboring the point.

This is how I feel. Something incredibly tragic happened here, and both of these men have to live with what happened for the rest of their lives.

This is my point.

...well, that and to purport that the last thing this man needs is somebody to tell him that it's his fault. He will know that every single day for the rest of his life.

I see the value of this thread to be to remind people to be responsible for young children, and for drivers to drive with caution.

I will usually drive in the center of the road in neighborhoods (unless a car is coming), specifically so I have time to see and react to little kids popping out from behind parked cars. The driver could possibly have avoided the situation, but if he was driving the speed limit and the kid came out from behind a bush/car/etc, I can't see that he is at fault.

If the parent wasn't negligent, the child wouldn't have been three houses away. Never the less in the pathway of a moving vehicle.

Well...perhaps. But as far as this thread is concerned, it seems that it is preaching to the choir. More accurately, I think, the value of this thread is to lord over the deficiencies of another person for whatever little solace it brings. If that works for some, then fine, but I can't play a part in it rather than absorbing the fact that real people are dealing with this very real, non-hypothetical situation as I type...can't do it. It makes me nauseous.

So I'll just bow out now and leave ya'll to it. :)

So he is at fault and he'll know it the rest of his life. But if anyone else points out he's wrong, or at fault, we're only doing so to "lord over the deficiencies of another person for whatever little solace it brings?"

Lost me with that logic.

I take no solace in this tragedy. Nor in the fact I believe the parent is at fault.

There's accidental tragedies and there are tragedies, this is the latter.

that was an unrelated incident.

different driver, different vehicle, different neighborhood.



that said, the father is to blame. I cant say I'd fault the driver, it could have happened to anyone, No one expects a 1 year old to be playing underneath their truck when it's time to go to work. I certainly dont check under or behind my car for kids belonging to deadbeat dads

This is the stuff of nightmares, seriously. I often have terrifying dreams of my son being run over (especially after seeing the play "Rabbit Hole"... *shudder*) It's heartbreaking because it could've easily been prevented. I really can't believe the toddler's father let him play fucking THREE HOUSES AWAY. You can't do that with a toddler!! Kids that young don't know not to play in driveways or run into the street (or do any number of other life-threatening things) which is why the parent should be practically on top of them, *especially* when they're playing near the street/driveways. There was only so much the driver could've done when the kid wasn't even as tall as his damn bumper.

What a horrible, horrible accident :(

Yes, I think some people are lording over this man's deficiencies which is a far cry from living with one's own personal guilt, uh yeah. :)

The article is all set up to pin responsibility on the father after a tragedy. Nice. Do we have any idea, aside from sketchy relative positions, of what really happened? Everyone knows that life is more complicated than it's painted in articles like this.

I don't know exactly what happened, the quoted policeman doesn't know, the journalist doesn't know and you don't know. We have some details, framed in a particular manner by the journalist for their own ends.

Was the driver singing, with closed eyes, to a beautiful line from a song important to them? Was the father taking an important call and distracted for a moment? Anyone who has been around kids knows there are times that you lose track of them. It happens. It is NOT negligence in anything but the pedantic sense.

This is a tragedy, plain and simple, likely nuanced with numerous facts that our gracious supplier of ground-out-page-filling-words-to-a-deadline in the media has decided to paint out, for whatever ignorant or (ig)noble reason.

Doesn't running from the point you're left at to judgement and apportioning of blame seem a tad ghoulish and righteous?

Some relatives of the deceased might well be regulars of this forum.

Matthew 7:1

I hope the father - and mother - find a way to cope with their loss.

I hope the driver finds a way to sleep at night.

I hope the little one didn't suffer.

For the rest, I don't know.

Then they have their own deficiencies. Doesn't mean a parent who let his one year old toddler wander off any less at fault when ill happens to that toddler. And it doesn't mean everyone with the opinion that the father actions were less then responsible have these deficiencies.

In a weird way this whole things reminds me of an incident that happened not long after I left the Navy. I went to work at a correctional work camp for juvenile offenders. One of the men, Alan, that worked there was a complete asshole. He was the second guy in charge. He fucked with the kids minds, he screwed with peoples schedules just for the fun of it. One time he fucked with a low IQ kid so bad the kid went out and burned a hole in his hand with a lit cigarette, by the time I got out to talk to him he was shaking and crying so hard he had stuff coming out his eyes, nose and mouth. Alan told him he'd be getting a home visit with his mom, then that he wouldn't, then he would and then back to no. He did this for days, finally the kid snapped. He came in at night and banged one of the co-workers in the back room leaving word if his wife called to tell her he was "out." He was an all around ASSHOLE. A little after a year on the job I came in one day and just walking in the room you could tell something was wrong. I asked "what's going on?" The manager told me maybe I should sit down. Shit I thought something happened to my wife or daughter. I sat and the manager explained to me "Alan, had a massive heart attack last night- he didn't make it." My first thought was "Ok, whats the bad news?" People sat around that office a lamented what a great guy Alan was. No Alan was an asshole, you all hated this guy... with a fucking passion. I didn't say a word. I sat and listened as these people spoke of all the nice things Alan had done, a lot of which was simply fiction. It was as if his dying made him a good guy. My thought was he was a live asshole and now he's a dead asshole, one less asshole in the world. Everyone wanted to go to the service, being low man I was scheduled to work. Fine by me, they gave me a "grief day" later that week. I took my kid fishing and never once thought of Alan. I never expressed to anyone there that I didn't think Alan's death changed the fact he was an awful human being. Nor would I tell the parent involved in this case that I think he's responsible, in any way, for his child death. But post it on a board I'm fairly certain he's never going to see, uh yeah.

To me this is a reckless tragedy. An accident is something that happens when you can't see it coming. To me an acccident would be- "we've been swinming on this beach for years, my parents brought me swimming here as a kid. The water was full of people playing and having fun. I was watching my kid closely, never left my sight. Never even heard of a shark being in these water. Now I have and now my son's gone."

A parent should foresee letting a one year old play several houses away near a street, even a quite street, could easily lead to a dangerous situation.

You have a point, the article is really brief and lacks details. But no one seems to dispute the one year old was several houses away from his parent. Kind of hard to justify letting a one year old get that far away on or near a street, IMO.

And I'm done here. I hear there's titties on the tittes board, this is simply too depressing.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/nation..._Daughter.html

This is quite the epidemic lately huh?

It begs this question:

If you drive cars so ludicrously large and impractical for an urban/sub-urban setting, can you rightfully claim not to have seen a toddler?

Size/weight/angles/etc. Almost everything seems against these cars in terms of driver awareness/ability to effectively perceive and react.

Aren't these SUV/tank things just incredibly dangerous as a concept?

playing in traffic is a dangerous concept too.

Big difference is you knew this man. You knew he was cruel. You don't know that about the guy we are talking about here. You don't know if he was smart or stupid or cruel or kind. Not once have I commended this man's actions or attributed them to his superior parenting skills, so I'm not quite sure why you are bringing this story up. Not that it's not an interesting story in its own right.

uh, yeah. :p

The father should have been paying attention and the drive should have been following the limits put on speed. If either one of them were being responsible that would not have happened.