Can someone explain "secret" to the CIA? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Daniel_ · 03-13-2006, 02:36 PM

Just seen this on the News...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4799174.stm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBC News

Internet blows CIA agents' cover

The CIA, based in Langley, Virginia, may have to update its methods

The Chicago Tribune says it has compiled a list of 2,653 CIA employees, just by searching the internet.
The newspaper said it gathered the information from online services that compile public data, that any fee-paying subscriber can access.

It did not publish the names, at the CIA's request. Many of the agents are believed to be covert. The paper also located two dozen "secret" facilities.

A CIA spokeswoman admitted the internet had scuppered some of its methods.

"Cover is a complex issue that is more complex in the internet age," said Jennifer Dyck.

"There are things that worked previously that no longer work. [CIA Director Porter] Goss is committed to modernising the way the agency does cover in order to protect our officers who are doing dangerous work."

Ms Dyck declined to detail the remedies "since we don't want the bad guys to know what we're fixing".

Terror targets?

The Chicago Tribune article was headlined: "Internet blows CIA cover."

It began: "She is 52 years old, married, grew up in the Kansas City suburbs and now lives in Virginia, in a new three-bedroom house."

It went on to explain that the online service describes the woman in question as a CIA employee who has been assigned to several American embassies in Europe.

The CIA confirmed that she was a covert operative.

The paper also identified facilities in Chicago, northern Virginia, Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Utah and Washington state. It said some were heavily guarded, but others appeared outwardly to be private residences.

Asked how so many personal details of CIA employees had found their way into the public domain, a senior US intelligence official told the Tribune "I don't have a great explanation, quite frankly".

Asked about fears that the details might be accessed by terrorist groups, he replied: "I don't know whether al-Qaeda could do this, but the Chinese could."

The disclosure comes as the US justice department continues an investigation into whether members of the Bush administration deliberately exposed the identity of CIA operative Valerie Plame.

Daniel_ · 03-13-2006, 02:37 PM

Ooops - forgot to say....

This is surely very very bad for the people in charge.

Toaster126 · 03-13-2006, 02:48 PM

Since when were people held accountable for things like this?

ASU2003 · 03-13-2006, 03:48 PM

Maybe those are the fake agents?

What if all the leaked info is just a cover to make a case for the justic dept to be able to get access to search engine data and delete/change indexes and data as needed to protect covert operations?

Willravel · 03-13-2006, 03:52 PM

Funny thing is, you can't find me on any of the public information networks. So you can find CIA operatives, but not me....mild mannored Willravel. It speaks in volumes about the level of competence at the CIA.

xepherys · 03-13-2006, 05:47 PM

ASU2003 could be very right. Having seen how the intelligence community in the military works, I can say for sure that sometimes outwardly stupid things are done on purpose for more devious reasons. I don't know if the reason would be for the justice department (though maybe), but I could certainly see at least a number of these being false leads. Don't the CIA folk seem a bit nonplussed by the whole thing? Where's the typical plausible deniability? Where's the PR spin? They seem too accepting that they "don't have a great explanation"... quite frankly...

JumpinJesus · 03-13-2006, 05:52 PM

Hmmm...It could be a type of red herring but then again if it's a government agency it's a bureaucracy which means that one hand often doesn't know what the other hand is doing, leading to snafus like this. Interesting story nonetheless.

Gatorade Frost · 03-13-2006, 06:54 PM

I can see how this happened because the internet is so hard to censor, the inf ormation on it, etc. If the CIA were to shut dow n a ton of websites with this CIA information on it, there would be uproar most likely.

You can blame it on bueracracy, which I'm sure part of it is, but in general I think a lot of it has to do with how hard it is to police the internet of this kind of thing.

stevie667 · 03-14-2006, 04:01 AM

The CIA is inept, so i can believe that they screwed up big time, but then again they are very devious, so it could be a set-up.

Funny stuff none-the-less.

hulk · 03-14-2006, 05:29 AM

Every job you go for in the US is linked to your social security number, right? I'd imagine the CIA would be no exception, and there is relatively easy access for those who have reason to obtain social security records. Debt collectors, law enforcement, etc. Once you have a list of people who work with the CIA it's a matter of finding out which ones do what. The CIA isn't going to confirm that with just about anyone - I'm surprised they confirmed it with the press.

xepherys · 03-14-2006, 07:15 AM

Covert operatives don't get payroll from the CIA. That would be a bit counterproductive. There's a reason they are called "covert".

Halx · 03-14-2006, 09:48 AM

Tough break to have a last name like Dyck.

rockogre · 03-14-2006, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xepherys

Having seen how the intelligence community in the military works, I can say for sure that sometimes outwardly stupid things are done on purpose for more devious reasons.

I have viewed this thread with some humor for exactly the same reason. You always do something flashy with the hand you want them to watch while you pick their pockets with the other.

I have a hard time believeing that the CIA would do anything this obviously stupid unless it really just didn't matter. It would be pretty easy to figure out most of who worked at the main center just by observing the traffic and having a way to run the plates if you had some government or the other backing you.

You are not going to find any of the real spooks by trolling the internet!

ASU2003 · 03-14-2006, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockogre

It would be pretty easy to figure out most of who worked at the main center just by observing the traffic and having a way to run the plates if you had some government or the other backing you.

Those are the analysts and management at Langley. The covert operatives usually never go near Washington DC/Virginia (At least I hope they don't).

rockogre · 03-14-2006, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

Those are the analysts and management at Langley. The covert operatives usually never go near Washington DC/Virginia (At least I hope they don't).

Pretty much my point.

03-13-2006, 02:37 PM	#2 (permalink)
Daniel_ Evil Priest: The Devil Made Me Do It! Location: Southern England	Ooops - forgot to say.... This is surely very very bad for the people in charge. __________________ ╔═════════════════════════════════════════╗ Overhead, the Albatross hangs motionless upon the air, And deep beneath the rolling waves, In labyrinths of Coral Caves, The Echo of a distant time Comes willowing across the sand; And everthing is Green and Submarine ╚═════════════════════════════════════════╝

03-13-2006, 02:48 PM	#3 (permalink)
Toaster126 Extreme moderation Location: Kansas City, yo.	Since when were people held accountable for things like this? __________________ "The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand) "The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

03-13-2006, 05:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
JumpinJesus Junkie Location: Chicago	Hmmm...It could be a type of red herring but then again if it's a government agency it's a bureaucracy which means that one hand often doesn't know what the other hand is doing, leading to snafus like this. Interesting story nonetheless. __________________ "I can normally tell how intelligent a man is by how stupid he thinks I am" - Cormac McCarthy, All The Pretty Horses

03-13-2006, 06:54 PM	#8 (permalink)
Gatorade Frost Rookie	I can see how this happened because the internet is so hard to censor, the inf ormation on it, etc. If the CIA were to shut dow n a ton of websites with this CIA information on it, there would be uproar most likely. You can blame it on bueracracy, which I'm sure part of it is, but in general I think a lot of it has to do with how hard it is to police the internet of this kind of thing. __________________ I got in a fight one time with a really big guy, and he said, "I'm going to mop the floor with your face." I said, "You'll be sorry." He said, "Oh, yeah? Why?" I said, "Well, you won't be able to get into the corners very well." Emo Philips

03-14-2006, 04:01 AM	#9 (permalink)
stevie667 Too Awesome for Aardvarks Location: Angloland	The CIA is inept, so i can believe that they screwed up big time, but then again they are very devious, so it could be a set-up. Funny stuff none-the-less. __________________ Office hours have changed. Please call during office hours for more information.

03-13-2006, 03:48 PM	#4 (permalink)
ASU2003 immoral minority Location: Back in Ohio	Maybe those are the fake agents? What if all the leaked info is just a cover to make a case for the justic dept to be able to get access to search engine data and delete/change indexes and data as needed to protect covert operations?

03-13-2006, 03:52 PM	#5 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Funny thing is, you can't find me on any of the public information networks. So you can find CIA operatives, but not me....mild mannored Willravel. It speaks in volumes about the level of competence at the CIA.

03-13-2006, 05:47 PM	#6 (permalink)
xepherys <3 TFP Location: 17TLH2445607250	ASU2003 could be very right. Having seen how the intelligence community in the military works, I can say for sure that sometimes outwardly stupid things are done on purpose for more devious reasons. I don't know if the reason would be for the justice department (though maybe), but I could certainly see at least a number of these being false leads. Don't the CIA folk seem a bit nonplussed by the whole thing? Where's the typical plausible deniability? Where's the PR spin? They seem too accepting that they "don't have a great explanation"... quite frankly...

03-14-2006, 05:29 AM	#10 (permalink)
hulk C'mon, just blow it. Location: Perth, Australia	Every job you go for in the US is linked to your social security number, right? I'd imagine the CIA would be no exception, and there is relatively easy access for those who have reason to obtain social security records. Debt collectors, law enforcement, etc. Once you have a list of people who work with the CIA it's a matter of finding out which ones do what. The CIA isn't going to confirm that with just about anyone - I'm surprised they confirmed it with the press. __________________ "'There's a tendency among the press to attribute the creation of a game to a single person,' says Warren Spector, creator of Thief and Deus Ex." -- From an IGN game review.

03-14-2006, 07:15 AM	#11 (permalink)
xepherys <3 TFP Location: 17TLH2445607250	Covert operatives don't get payroll from the CIA. That would be a bit counterproductive. There's a reason they are called "covert".

03-14-2006, 09:48 AM	#12 (permalink)
Halx Please touch this. Owner/Admin Location: Manhattan	Tough break to have a last name like Dyck. __________________ You have found this post informative. -The Administrator [Don't Feed The Animals]