NFL 2012 Discussion Thread

What I mean is that Bill Shankly famously said "football isnt a matter of life or death, its far more important than that".

And I disagree.

When its someone's life... a game shouldnt matter that much. Whether its the juice, the pressure, the head injuries, the corruption... it's not worth a man's life. It aint worth 3 orphaned kids. Not for me at least.

 

I think you're jumping to conclusions assuming that his suicide was about football in any way.

 

Perhaps, but there was a guy earlier this year, who shot himself because of depression caused directly by football injuries.

And direct causes are normally hard to judge. This man may have had many other issues, but it would be hard to say that many of the issues retired players face were or were not related.

And even if they are not... the simple tragedy of the fact puts into perspective whether Jonathan Wilma will be taking out any outside ACL's for the next 16 weeks or not.

Football is a tough game, and that's part of the reason people love to play it and watch it, the physical confrontation - but we all as fans have to face up to paying these men millions to compete violently against each other under the highest pressure imaginable, and what it means.

 

Dave Duerson. That's even sadder if it's true.

 

My first reaction was "that's shitty."

My second reaction was "no, actually, that's not. Motherfucker deserves no favors or courtesy."

 

I think anyone deserves to look their judges in the face when given the sentence.

I have no objection to the guy getting a year ban though, but the team should be hit harder. He and the coaching staff weren't doing this in isolation. But they have to make an example of someone, I get that.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by hitting the team harder. What more do you want? They suspended the coach directly involved indefinitely, the head coach for the entire season, and the GM for half the season. Not to mention a few other shorter suspensions. And then there was a big fine ($500k?).

I don't think you've been following the story that closely.

 

NFL isnt a big news story in the UK obviously, but I follow the sport relatively closely.

I don't think 500,000 is a big fine for an NFL franchise.

Making them lose for 1 or 2 seasons (which is what all of the suspensions amount to) isn't enough. (and to be honest they could still be a .50 team next season with everything else, if they can get Brees back on board)

They should have been fined, and the level of the fine should have been set to mean something to an organisation which is worth about 950,000,000 (according to Forbes.com anyway) in my opinion.

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The best article I read about the whole bounty thing basically broke it down like this:

If you're a starting NFL player, and someone takes out your ACL, or touches the head enough to put you out for a season or a career... well, its a tough sport and you were very very well rewarded for playing at this level, but you knew the risks.

But when people see this kind of play and this kind of attitude, it drips down through every level of football.

I wish I remember where the article was from as I am sure it tells the story better than me, but it basically talks about a HS game that the writer had access to. A bigger school was losing at half time to a smaller team... and the coach is raving at his players at half time... saying (and this is a quote I think) "I want you to put this player out on a stretcher. I want to see his mother crying in the stands..." and the guy does get hurt in the second half, and the bigger team wins (we dont know if the mother cried)

And the point was, look at HS football players and college football players. Look at how many at 25, 35, 45, 55 are going through life still affected by injuries they received playing at school or college for fun... people with bum knee's, problems sleeping because of concussions, etc etc. These guys arent being paid a million a season. These guys didnt know the risks when they signed up for it.

And you can never get away from people being hurt in a contact sport, but everything that you see in the NFL that is just encouraging and glorifying basically violent play... it all feeds into the lower forms of the leagues, and it all means more and more kids playing next year will get hurt.

And thats why they need to come down on the Saints like a ton of bricks in my opinion. Maybe other people were doing it. They got caught and they kept doing it. And I think they need to be made a real example of.

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So, as you say, as I am in the UK maybe I dont follow the sport as closely as some Americans... but I make an effort to watch the games in the middle of the night through the season, have to follow the news via podcasts because no TV station in the UK carries it, and I have an opinion of my own.
--- merged: May 2, 2012 at 5:54 PM ---

I can only repeat, if someone fined me 500,000, it would certainly be massive. It would be equal to maybe my next 7/8 years salary before tax or any living expenses. (or maybe some less if I get promoted any time in the period)

If someone fines the Saints 500,000, it is a bit under the revenue they make in 1 day (again, based on what I read on forbes.com, based on 2010 numbers. I do not call this massive.

 

@strange_famous, you're ignoring that the punishments are unprecendented. There's never been anything close to this handed out in the NFL.

 

If they have a winning season next year, how can the punishment be enough?

They already knew they were losing Vilma and they covered it in free agency... its hard to assess how much losing the head coach and GM will mean, but its also hard to believe that they both of them don't own a different anon pay as you go cell phone for every week of the next year.

In my opinion they need to be hit where it hurts them as an organisation. I would call for a fine which is assessed at a level that basically makes them an unprofitable business for at least one year.
--- merged: May 2, 2012 at 6:10 PM ---

Come on, you work in business, you know that doesn't wash.

As an owner or as a director of a company, it is not good enough to say you didn't know. You have a responsibility to know.

If a company commits fraud, or ignores health and safety legislation and someone is hurt or killed, they come for the owners and directors, and they judge that they had an absolute legal responsibility to know.

I make the argument that exactly the same principle applies when your organisation is overtly paying people to try and inflict injuries on other people.

 

RIP Junior

Former NFL player Junior Seau dead - CNN.com

 

I heard the same thing. That's a bad injury for anyone.

 

Not quite. The 8th member of the 1994 team to die:

Junior Seau's death further saddens his 1994 Chargers teammates - Yahoo! Sports