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Labels of Sexism/Racism, when is it enough.

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Perfxion, Aug 10, 2011.

  1. The most recent cover of Newsweek has Michelle Bachmann on the cover, with the title "Queen of Rage". In a typical Washington D.C. angle of attack the source, not the content. The labels of "sexism" get thrown around. Now, for those that haven't seen the cover, here is the actual cover being in question.
    [​IMG]

    Now to get a topic going, when can this card and the race card not be so quick to be drawn? This along with the 2009 stance by some Democrats, "Calling President Obama a socialist is just another way to get around calling him the n-word". When its used for non warranted issues, it loses its meaning. Now, I am not going to get into the whole Birther thing, which really did have race playing a factor, but some stories are just overboard with these terms being used.
     
  2. DrSublime

    DrSublime New Member

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Obama's a socialist due to his policy and his Obamacare.. Nothing do with his race

    The race and sex card gets pulled when it's in the best interest of the individual to use it... Because it works most of the time

    Sent from my HTC Evo using Tapatalk
     
  3. roachboy

    roachboy Very Tilted

    it's remarkable to consider the extent to which the success of roger ailes-style faux news politics, and that of the legion of intellectual bottom-feeders who feed into and from it, relies on the production of stupid little memes that can be handled like a pastry and mooshed into the face of whichever public figure is the officially sanctioned object of the conservative group hate of the moment.

    socialist? obama? on what fucking planet? his health care plan? socialist?
    you don't know what you're talking about.
    words have historical referents, you know. there's more to them than their meme-values.
    maybe get a dictionary.

    "the race card"---didn't this little meme originate with the o.j. simpson trial? funny how the conservative apparatus picked up on it. fits right into the facile thinking that imagines there is such a thing as "reverse discrimination"--which is a lynchpin in the discursive construction of the petit-bourgeois victim so much a part of conservative identity politics.

    i recall that in conservativeland racism's been "fixed" right? we're o so by that now.

    please.

    bachman? the word that repeatedly springs to mind is idiot.
     
  4. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    I'm not sure I get the OP. Are you saying that people who call Bachmann a "rager" or a "birther" are charged with being sexist? Can you clarify what's going on with the cover, the article, and what people are saying about those who criticize Bachmann?

    The thing about Obama's "socialism" is that it was a false label. This may lead some to assume that people would call Obama a socialist as a way to denigrate him "safely" instead of going after his race. Either way, calling him a socialist or going after his race are fallacious attacks that should be denounced.

    I should say that I hate the term "pulling the race card" or "playing the race card." It has lost its meaning because people say that in virtually every situation where the topic turns to race. It's pointless. What it does is delegitimize race as a factor in politics or culture. That in itself is a source of concern with regard to race.

    Calling Obama a socialist isn't racist in itself, but one must wonder what wholesale criticism of him must mean if the labels don't match the actions.

    Obama would make a terrible socialist. He's on the wrong side of the spectrum.

    What health care plan? It was an insurance scheme.
     
  5. Frosstbyte

    Frosstbyte Winter is coming

    Location:
    The North
    I'm not particularly sure what aspect of that cover is supposed to be sexist. Do you have a link to an article or editorial which discusses who thinks that cover is sexist and why? Are you asking more generally about sexism being used to criticize female candidates?

    My only comment about that cover is that she looks fucking terrifying. Intentionally or unintentionally, that picture makes her look like she's just been touched by madness itself. Or, perhaps, by one too many facelifts. Either way. (Was that sexist?)
     
  6. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    ^ She does have a kind of "I'mma gonna kill you" look....
     
  7. samcol

    samcol Getting Tilted

    Location:
    indiana
    the left really should stop calling every criticism of the president racist. the problem is that it causes the right to cognitively shutdown everytime it's used. so the lefts legitimate arguments are totally ignored by the right because they have to bring race into the picture instead of sticking to the issues.
     
  8. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    The left doesn't do this universally. This lefty would sooner say, "Get a clue," to many of the criticisms of Obama, especially the socialist/communist ones. They are so off the mark it's ridiculous. I can't think of much that Obama has done in office that hasn't been attempted or accomplished on a categorical level by a Republican president. I'd welcome anyone to point things out to me, and I'd also welcome them to demonstrate how those things would be classified as particularly socialist.

    I would then probably point out that socialism is so infused in American society that everyone participates in it to some degree every day.

    It doesn't make them all socialists.
     
  9. roachboy

    roachboy Very Tilted

    what left are you talking about exactly?
    who exactly refers to every criticism of obama as racist? that sounds to me like projection.
    it also excludes a fairly significant aspect of political reality--there are **lots** of people well to the left of obama who are very critical of his centrist administration.
    so once again the right works to construct an imaginary world for that demographic in which their political comportments are normal because they mirror those of others.
    which is false.

    and the right cannot concede the simple fact that obama is a centrist because that positions them on the extreme right. which is where, in fact, they now are.
     
  10. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    It also often becomes a strawman.

    The left calls every criticism of Obama racist = The left has no criticism of Obama, the left has no counterargument to those who criticize Obama
     
  11. MSD

    MSD Very Tilted

    Location:
    CT
    If Obama's policies and healthcare plan were socialist, I would have much less to complain about. He's a wishy-washy moderate and folds to right-wing interests at the mere suggestion of confrontation.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. samcol

    samcol Getting Tilted

    Location:
    indiana
    make no mistake, the only reason obama's policy aren't more socialist is because of the pressure from the right. he continually has to compromise with the right even due to the overwhelming pressure from the right. it happened on healthcare and it happened on this debt issue.
     
  13. Ourcrazymodern?

    Ourcrazymodern? still, wondering

    So she looks crazy. She's a powermonger with no excuse except her asshole. She claimed not to have seen the cover. I don't believe her. Her rights end where mine begin. I can smell her from here...
     
  14. I seen many articles calling that Bachmann photo sexist. How I don't know. I seen many people this year and in 08 use the "If you are criticizing Bachmann/Clinton, you are being a sexist". I started this thread more in lines with the general, race and sexism get thrown around too much. There are times when it is an issue, other times it is an utter joke. People who don't have an argument are generally the first to throw those words around to attack the person not the issue.

    I was flat out saying that for some people in the Birther issue, race was involved. Not the main sticking point for all, but race was a factor in some of this nonsense. No other President or serious candidate had keep going other this issue over and over again. I know that Bachmann was a birther, but not everything was completely about race. But some people in the Dem and liberal world were using the line "if you keep saying Obama is a socialist, then you really want to say he is a n-". Which is fallacy on several points, since for one, he isn't a socialist. Two, he is left leaning center, and most importantly, not every criticism of the president is about race, its about his policies.
     
  15. samcol

    samcol Getting Tilted

    Location:
    indiana
    i agree the political correctness is destroying legitimate debate.

    i don't think that photo is sexist, however it is totally unflattering and possibly not touched up like every news magazine is nowadays to make the cover look appealing.

    it may be your opinion that he's not socialist which is fine, but ya at no point of someone declaring obama a socialist should that person be considered racist. imo it really does a disservice to legitimate race problems. hillary could of enacted the exact same policies and would of been labeled a socialist as well. socialism or capitalism or any other form of economics has nothing to do with race.

    there's no question that there are racists in the tea party. what percent of the tea party is racist? 1%, 5%, 10%? i have no idea, but i dont believe it's any more than any other political groups. which political party doesn't have bigots and extremists? in any political group as large as the tea party you're going to find racists, rioters, criminals, provocateurs. the racist signs i've seen in the news at tea party rallies are noteworty, but they aren't a good representation of what i've witnessed at several events. i saw a a couple signs that were retarded in a group of 3000. does that really mean the whole group has to be racist?

    i can find similarly retarded signs at any event that involves at movement with many members.
     
  16. Ourcrazymodern?

    Ourcrazymodern? still, wondering

    I apologize, Perfxion, for my awkward response. I DO NOT LIKE Michelle Bachman because she strikes me as self-serving & uncaring. I don't see how that cover picture could be construed as sexist without the title including "Queen". Should I take that as a slam on somebody else entirely? I don't think so, & I wonder about people who legitimize their reactions to perceived slights with buzz-word titles that end in ism. I don't wonder about the publishers' motives because it would cut into my haiku-writing time. Or it bores me. I forgot somebody merged politics.
     
  17. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    Can you point me to anything outlining Barack Obama's history of socialism? Because as far as I know, all of his compromises were simply moving him from the centre to the right.

    Support for universal healthcare and for raising revenues while cutting spending doesn't make you a socialist.

    Is this what the right thinks of itself? As some kind of heroic force defeating the socialist president?

    This thinking would outline a serious issue the right has: it has a problem of adequately challenging liberal policies, and so it must demonize them as socialist (which in America is, by default, a nonstarter because socialism is "evil"). This is the only way the right can navigate political discourse. It's the only way they can have their ideology stand: it's by using strawman tactics and then positing their ideas as the only rightful course.

    As far as integrity of meaning is concerned, it's nearly as bad as racism and sexism.
     
  18. roachboy

    roachboy Very Tilted

    gee, what a horrifying idea, health care for children of lower-income folk. those people are all parasites anyway. their kids deserve to get sick.
    any other viewpoint is obviously socialist. stalinist. bad.

    what an idiotic critique. i cannot believe that horseshit gets taken seriously by anyone in their right mind. maybe it doesn't.

    the problem with bachman is not only that she's not real bright, but that her politics are appalling. combine the two and you end up with an indication of just how bankrupt intellectually the republican party is. i assume the charges of sexism about the photo in the op are all coming from the right. that'd be tossing around an inflammatory term in the interests of damage control.
     
  19. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    It doesn't even need to go that far. I think for many on the right, it's a thought pattern that may progress as such: "Oh, these poor folk can't afford health care for their children? Well, that's not my problem. Why should I have to pay for it? They're not my children. Maybe their parents should have practiced abstinence. They obviously can't afford children, so I don't know why they had them in the first place. I don't demand handouts for my children. I don't expect free stuff, I work for it. So should they."

    I get the feeling that the right believes poverty and the lower classes exist only because people are lazy or impotent. If only more people were like them, and there wouldn't be any need for government handouts. Everyone would work hard and everyone would afford to pay for their own needs. Right?

    Sexism or not, if Bachmann is among the best of who the Republicans have to offer as presidential material, I suppose that is rather daunting.

    I mean, is she it?

    A homophobic, antifeminist, creationist, warhawk, quasi-libertarian economic isolationist?

    Really? I hope not.
     
  20. Bodkin van Horn

    Bodkin van Horn One of the Four Horsewomyn of the Fempocalypse

    This whole Obama is a socialist thing might not be so easily attributed to racism if Obama's policies were even remotely socialist. Seems more akin to restaurant staff calling black customers "canadians" as a way of talking about them without sounding racist.

    When your criticisms of someone in no way resemble the reality of that person, it is perfectly natural for the casual observer to suspect that your criticism serves as a proxy for something you're unwilling to mention. Maybe it isn't racism, but it's something and it has nothing to do with actual socialism.
    --- merged: Aug 11, 2011 3:34 AM ---
    For the record, Bachmann is a former tax attorney who has repeatedly asked and received handouts from the government. Even now, she's begging the government to build a bridge in her district when a perfectly serviceable bridge is within a short distance of the site where she wants the new bridge to go.