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Free-Range Parenting

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by snowy, Apr 15, 2015.

  1. snowy

    snowy so kawaii Staff Member

    Lately, there have been some cases in the news of children roaming the streets of their neighborhoods being picked up by law enforcement after neighbors called the cops. Here is an article on the main incident in question. Essentially, some kids in Silver Spring, Maryland, 10 and 6, were allowed to walk to the local park, a neighbor complained, and they spent hours in police custody afraid that they weren't going to see their parents again. This follows on an incident in December where much the same thing happened.

    ‘Free-range’ family again at center of debate after police pick up children - The Washington Post

    ‘Free-range’ parents plan to file lawsuit after police pick up children - The Washington Post

    And a piece from the mother of the kids on how we're raising kids to be afraid: When letting your kids out of your sight becomes a crime - The Washington Post

    The idea of so-called "free-range parenting" is really nothing new. Frankly, it's exactly how I was raised. I had limits to where I could go safely, but otherwise, I was free to roam around as I wished. As part of the current zeitgeist, the term cropped up in 2009 with the publication of Lenore Skenazy's book on the subject, and because of the furor generated over the fact that she let her 9-year-old son ride the subway alone (More From America's Worst Mom: 9-Year-Old On The Subway, Continued | Lenore Skenazy). This recent column in the New York Times gives an overview of Skenazy's philosophy (I bolded part of it that I think is important to realize and remember):

    http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/01/19/advice-from-americas-worst-mom/

    So, some questions I have: Why the hell would you call the cops on two unsupervised children? Why wouldn't you go ASK them what was going on? Are we so afraid of approaching children in a public space that we'd rather call in law enforcement? What happened to letting kids be kids?

    Personally, I think the response was ridiculous. Way to scare the shit out of small kids and make them afraid of law enforcement for life. I know (by virtue of also being a mandatory reporter) that there is an obligation to report and investigate, but I do think we need to reexamine what "proper supervision" is. If proper supervision is being within a twenty-foot range of your child, then I know plenty of parents guilty of neglect. If a kid has a cell phone with him, knows how to use it, and their parents know where they are, how is that improper supervision? As a child exploring my neighborhood, there were plenty of times my mom didn't know exactly where I was, and that was fine and good. It gave me time and space to be a kid and to figure out how to solve problems on my own.

    I'm grateful that I live in a community where seeing kids by themselves is not abnormal or weird. Kids play in the parks by themselves regularly. Last weekend, there were kids circling a local park trying to sell snowcones and Kool-Aid sans parental supervision. When I ride the city bus, I often see kids who are in late elementary school catching a ride down to the library. Young children still walk alone to their neighborhood schools here. My community is not that much smaller than Silver Spring, yet I guess we're hippified enough to relax about this kind of thing. I wish everyone else would, too. We need to give kids space to be kids.
     
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  2. Stan

    Stan Resident Dumbass

    Location:
    Colorado
    I'm fine with the 10yr old walking a mile to the park. I used to go swimming and fishing by myself at the same age.

    I'm not so fine with a 10yr old being tasked with taking care of his 6 yr old sister. Taking care of himself is enough for a 10yr old.
     
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  3. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    Not only scare the hell out of the kids but in the article I read the cops didn't call the parents right away so they are looking for their kids for a couple of hours after the children are supposed to be home.
    Finally the dickheads called to say the kids were in custody.
    The kids might have been 'free-range' but they still had some what of a tether, which is the way I was raised.
    Now granted I grew up in an area where the closest neighbor was 2 miles away but we would disappear all day.
    My mom used an air horn to call us back, one long, 2 shorts and a long, which is the railroad crossing single.
    A couple of times I came home because I heard the train go through one of two dirt roads in our area.

    So, yes just about as free range as you can get but there was risks in those days too.
    My best friend and his uncle were murdered by a drugged out asshole they picked up hitchhiking.
    That didn't change the way my mom handled things though she did make sure we knew how to shoot and she was a pacifist.

    She was a deep believer in the story of the old Quaker who on finding a burglar in his house, said "Friend, I would not hurt thee for the world but thee is standing where I am about to shoot."
     
  4. girldetective

    girldetective Getting Tilted

    I raised my girls purposely with independence, in the middle of a city. At 2, they carried their own library books as we walked home, and they helped me cook their breakfasts on a daily basis. At 3 and 4, they walked two houses down on the same side of the street as myself and the other parent stood on the porches and watched them; their friends did this, too. We frequently walked to the park, and my youngest was taking swimming at the Y at 1.5 yo. We talked about the world at our table, and they were well versed in landmarks around the city. Both were familiar with the bus system and were probably 12 when they began to ride it with friends sans parent, carrying transit maps with them. They were educated, arty nerdgirls, and the motto at my home was Have fun be sensible, and I said it almost daily. I beleive they felt safe and behaved coherently because they were educated in the ways of the world and how to behave - not just by me, but by their teachers, neighbors, peers, books, maps, and so forth. This is their world, and I wanted them to feel free, and be free, enough to walk around it, experience it, and find the joy in living. I am happy to read about parents who are somewhat trusting of their children, their neighborhood, and their own parenting. I find it refreshing.

    As for the cops who did not call the parents immediately upon taking the children into possession? I think they should be arrested, not for checking on the kids safety but for taking them into custody at all. Instead, perhaps they could have escorted the children, preferably by foot, to their parent(s) for a lively reunion.
     
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  5. Levite

    Levite Levitical Yet Funky

    Location:
    The Windy City
    This has gotten way out of hand. When will we realize that this kind of overprotective sheltering of our kids not only makes them afraid, inhibited, and incompetent at living on their own, but it also does little good in terms of keeping them safe.

    Stranger abductions of children, despite what Law and Order: SVU would have us believe, are quite rare. The vast majority of abductions, child abuse and child homicide cases revolve around perpetrators the child knows well, or to whom they are related.

    When I was growing up, starting from when I was around five, I was often given permission to walk a couple of blocks to my best friend's house to play. Starting from when I was seven or so, I was often permitted to walk a few blocks further to the park, and play there unsupervised. When I was eight, I could walk alone around a quarter of a mile to the store to get stuff, or to the used bookstore next to it, where I had leave to sit and read as long as I pleased. When I was nine, I could walk a mile to the Hillel House where my dad was the rabbi, or to the local library branch, or to the video arcade (yes, I am that old). And by the time I was ten, I could take the bus downtown to the main library, or to go to the movies. Or walk two miles to the local pool and swim there. Granted, this was in Minneapolis, which was pretty staid and peaceful, even at the turn of the '80s. But still....

    It's ludicrous to think that in a few years, when my son is six or seven, I will likely be facing investigation if I let him walk two blocks to the park and play there for a while unsupervised. What's just as bad now is that I find I am afraid to leave my sleeping kid in the car for five or ten minutes (when it is neither hot nor very cold) while I run into the store for something. I am not afraid that anything will happen to my kid. He could sleep through a jetliner taking off next to him, once he actually falls asleep. I am afraid of what might happen to me: that someone will see him, and call the cops on me. When I was a kid, I got left in the car while my folks ran into the store all the time. Everyone I knew, same thing. And not just when I was sleeping. They would leave me with a toy or two, or when I was a little older, a book or two, and I would play or read. No problem. But I'm pretty sure doing that now is courting having CPS called on you.

    I do grant you that I personally would probably not let a ten-year-old look after a six-year-old. But I could also imagine it might depend on the kids in question, and what they were doing. If both kids were quite bright, capable, and responsible, and it was something straightforward like walking to the park, playing, and walking home, I might.

    Things like that need to be the decision of parents. Not of nosy neighbors or cops or CPS reps who absolutely must have better things to do with their time and resources.

    It's just becoming absurd.
     
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  6. spindles

    spindles Very Tilted

    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    I have kids this age. Funnily enough my older boy is much more cautious and is only this year happy to walk to school sans parents because his little brother is with him. I know quite a few parents and these range on a scale from:
    1. don't let the kids out of sight
    all the way to
    2. they are old enough to cross roads, therefore they don't need a huge amount of supervision.

    I think I am somewhere in the middle.

    RE the article, I'd be more likely to approach kids if they looked like they were in trouble, rather than ringing the police, but if they looked fine I'd leave them to it. You don't see a lot of unsupervised kids around here, though.

    My scout troop had a recent night where the kids went unsupervised to the local supermarket to buy food for a cooking night. It was interesting to note how many of them found this to be a new experience (the youngest is my 10yo). You do have to loosen the apron strings at some point.
     
  7. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & be quiet.

    Location:
    Large City, TX
    When I was a kid my mom would only let us stay in the house X amount of time before were ordered to "go get some fresh air." This was several decades before video games, cable TV, cell phones, social media, etc. We only had to give a general idea of where we were going, and we covered many miles on foot and/or on bicylces. The main requirement was we had to be back home about an hour before dinner.

    Our current "information age" is wonderful in many aspects, but IMO it gives & causes exaggerated views of the level of crime. In some of my communications classes studies were discussed that showed people who didn't get out and watched/listned to a lot of news media tended to be much more apprehensive about crime than people who got out and psrticipated in society. And this was back in the mid '80s.
     
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  8. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Calling the PC police (almost literally) :rolleyes:

    There's no reason they should be harassed and inconvenience like this.
    I could understand driving up and checking on them briefly...but not going to this extent, much less the following legal penalties on the parents (no matter how minor)

    I was raised with a fair amount of discretion. And I ranged greatly.
    My limits were more on my time (be home at...) and behavior (no climbing the store roofs...which I did...)

    To this day, I see no limits on my exploration...other than financial and escaping work obligations.
    "What's over the hill" is an adventure waiting to happen.
     
  9. genuinemommy

    genuinemommy Moderator Staff Member

    I am not ok with raising my daughter(s) free-range. We put a lot of thought into this decision and chose our home accordingly. We saw a few neighborhoods where free-range is common and encouraged. We were honestly not comfortable with what we observed happening with what turned into awkward unsupervised hoards of unruly children.


    We have a big backyard for her to enjoy. The nearest park is too far away to walk. There is no safe way to walk to a nearby store, as crossing a freeway would be necessary. We have good neighbors. She will enjoy that aspect of our community.

    No, it's not for me. I thought it might be before I had a child. But it's not.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2015
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  10. oldtimer56

    oldtimer56 umime

    Location:
    East Texas
    The law wants to rule our everyday lives to the point mind control. Hadn't they made enough enemies by the numerous murders committed by lawmen across this land? Lucky for the kids, they didn't get shot or tazed.
    Grew up in the rural south pre-segregation, 60s - early 70s, free range was a understatement. Our Moms threw us out first thing in the morning after breakfast, explore the lands, Expand our minds, played with the black kids across the tracks. Generally had fun but always under the watchful eye of a parent somewhere. It took a while for me to accept that todays world is not much difference, except for the nanny government.
     
  11. PonyPotato

    PonyPotato Very Tilted

    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    Growing up on a farm or a yard surrounded by pastures, "free range" meant me, my sister, and our closest neighbors playing in the fields, creeks, and occasionally the barns. There's a lot less trouble you can get into when you're surrounded by fences and play with what nature has to offer, rather than the "street smart" sort of free range that is possible in the city. I don't think I'd let my kids roam in the city, but within a fenced pasture? As long as none of the animals sharing the pasture are aggressive and the kids know to leave the animals alone, go for it!
     
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  12. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    This is a tricky one. Now, I don't care if other parents want to let their kids explore on their own. I don't care, unless it is way out of the ordinary like a 4 year old walking down the street at 10 pm.

    I had a childhood of riding my bike a mile or two from home. But, I have no idea how old I was. I do know that I got myself to school whenever the weather was nice from Kindergarten through High School and I was fine being left alone and doing my own thing.

    This is one of those things that I would worry about if I ever had one kid someday. If people have three or four, I think it is easier to let them wonder on their own. I'm not sure why I think this. Maybe it is a big city/medium city/small city issue. Or a wilderness/nature issue causing harm. I did know about kidnappers growing up, but not the sexual predators. It also wouldn't have made national news like it probably would today with a bunch of other parents saying, "we told you this would happen".
     
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  13. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    This. All forms of violent crime have dropped by over 80% in my lifetime alone, the world is safer today than it has ever been in almost any living person's lifetime. On top of that there's the matter of demographics; "Stranger Danger" in general is very nearly a myth, overwhelmingly the most dangerous people to children are their parents followed closely by extended family and trusted authority figures.

    The current climate of utter terror over the dangers facing Women And Children™ is nothing short of outright mass hysteria. I don't think the Satanic Panic of the 80's ever actually ended, it just put on a clean shirt and kept going.

    I wouldn't do it not necessarily because they couldn't, but because they shouldn't. Like Stan said taking care of themselves is enough for a 10 year old, don't make them worry about taking care of someone else just yet.
     
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  14. spindles

    spindles Very Tilted

    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    I even think this danger is overstated. Unconfirmed reports on sites like facebook just make the spread of hysteria easier. We had a talk from the local police school liaison officer last year about internet safety. The way she talked, you'd think creepy people were everywhere stalking young folk. It pays to be cautious, but not to the point you are jumping at every shadow.

    As a person in an authority position (I help out at school, coach a soccer team and am a scout leader), I find there is a group of people who almost look at you like you *are* that creepy guy. Scouts particularly state as leaders we need to always have two leaders present (or if doing one on one stuff, that you do it within a public space so you can always be seen), specifically to avoid the "he is alone with (a) boy(s)" issue.
     
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  15. snowy

    snowy so kawaii Staff Member

    As someone who has to train every year on child abuse and neglect, and who took a 400-level course on the subject, I'll confirm the fact that strangers aren't really a danger at all. Most harm or abuse is perpetrated by someone the kid knows. Yet because it's a myth we've perpetrated so widely, kids no longer know how to relate to adults they don't know. I've seen this in action. I was nannying two kiddos a number of years ago, and an older gentleman approached us while we were out at Great Harvest enjoying a cinnamon roll. The older kiddo knew that it was okay to talk to the gentleman in question (who was just being nice and friendly, in a neighborly way, and talked to me first to ask about the kids' soccer jerseys) because I was present, but the younger kiddo freaked out and wouldn't talk at all, and when prompted, he said he shouldn't talk to strangers. I had to explain that it was okay, I was right there, and the guy was just being kind.

    Seriously, why the fuck are we so afraid of other people?
     
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  16. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    Because it suits certain powerful interests to keep the majority of people divided, fearful, and hateful of one another.
     
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  17. Borla

    Borla Moderator Staff Member

    I thought of this thread when I stumbled across this article today:


    There's a parenting trend that's taken over the US, and it's changing children everywhere - Yahoo Finance





    We lived in a small town of about 2000 people until I was 9. Both of my parents had lived their teen years there, so by that point they knew most everyone. By the time I was 5-6 I was allowed to take my bike up to the store, 3 blocks away, for small items my mom might need, to the post office 3 blocks away, or to get my haircut at the barber shop 3 blocks away. I remember being tasked with riding my bike to the bank (maybe 6-7 blocks?) once with the mortgage check, I couldn't have been more than 8. There was a large park that was in our block, one house between us and the park. Once I was school aged I was generally allowed to go to the park unaccompanied when I wanted. I think with some of these things, like being sent to the store or bank, I learned some valuable lessons in responsibility, and how to act in public on my own.

    From the ages of 9-12 we lived in a rural area, so there really weren't any options for being "free range". Once we moved back into town (a larger, neighboring town from where I grew up), I was generally allowed to ride my bike within several blocks of home from the age of 12 on. From maybe 13-14 I was allowed to ride anywhere I wanted, assuming I had a destination and realized when I'd be expected back. This seemed fairly normal for kids my age.

    Looking back, I think my parents were fairly reasonable. But by today's standards, they'd probably be lambasted for sending a 6yr old to the store, or to get his haircut on his own. Even at 12, riding a couple of miles away to a friend's house might be pushing it. Honestly, topics like these are ones I'm glad I am avoiding by not raising kids. I'm pretty sure that my standards would differ from the standards of many, in many areas (some stricter, some looser), and it'd end up being a frequent point of contention.
    --- merged: Apr 17, 2015 at 6:29 PM ---
    Just saw this........no fear of "free range parenting" here. :eek:

    Parents write insanely demanding invitation for their son's first birthday party
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 24, 2015
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  18. snowy

    snowy so kawaii Staff Member

    • Like Like x 1
  19. Stan

    Stan Resident Dumbass

    Location:
    Colorado
    Or a puppy. I wouldn't actually do that to a puppy; but Molly adores 1 yr olds and it is always mutual. I'm sure those parents would be fine with a bit of slobber.
     
  20. Borla

    Borla Moderator Staff Member

    We are babysitting tonight. The 4yr old is eye to eye with Stanley. They are both in love.