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Politics What is happening????

Discussion in 'Tilted Philosophy, Politics, and Economics' started by pan6467, Apr 23, 2012.

  1. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    Location:
    Temasek
    Interesting to note the amount of money being spent to tear down vs. support the Affordable Care Act.

    And one wonders about the shape of public opinion when $700 million is spent to oppose something, versus $27 million.

     
  2. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    What I find funny about that is the 'Between Two Ferns' piece that the President did with Zach Galifianckis was never on TV, cost a few thousand dollars to make and pulled in at least a hundred thousand sign ups.
    Gotta know your audience.
     
  3. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    And what I find funny...are those who protest spending money...are those who throw money at things.

    In truth, they are not worried about money spent...but what the money is spent on.
    If you don't care for the people or project, you don't want your money going there.

    But they have NO hesitation in throwing money to do what they want...or support those they are in cahoots with.

    Hypocrisy knows no bounds.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    And as a followup to my previous post,
    I want to not this...NOT from a liberal context...but as an argument vs extreme libertarian/anarchist context. (and I have a Libertarian streak in me too)

    That no effort or entity in this current society is an island.
    It is interacting with the utilities and infrastructure and efforts of the whole.

    I believe in Libertarianism from a privacy context...or overreach of regulation
    ...but not from an anti-govt/rebellious or null regulation one.

    This says it all right here...
    “There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own,” she said. “Nobody. You built a factory out there? Good for you. But I want to be clear: You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for.” It was all part of “the underlying social contract,”
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2014
    • Like Like x 4
  5. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    I've been saving these, during my time away for the holiday...Big Data, Data Mining, Data Hacking...and so on.

    Everything is about info...on you.
    Can there be any right to privacy any more???
    And it's NOT from your government mostly you should fear...it's mostly the businesses you buy from, the places you go...and the traces you leave behind.

    If you only knew...what I know from inside the data industry...what the NSA collects is nothing by comparison.
    We are heading to a time of "Minority Report" where they can do real-time profiling on you from your history...in a split second.
    How much do you want others knowing of YOUR life???

    Me...I know how to filter and clean...where to restrict and erase...MOST don't know diddly.
    Can the govt protect us from this intrusion?? Especially when there is so much money to be made from it...and a conflict of interest.
    I think they will.
    Why? Because when the congresspeople get zapped by the same techniques...they'll get scared and act.
    That's what the US Founding Fathers were afraid of...everyone, including themselves.

    -----------------
    Now it's not like what the commerical asks..."What's in your wallet?"
    ...It's WHO knows what's in your wallet... and in your life ...and what you are doing.
     
  6. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    And as a followup and good summary for what I was talking about above on Data.

    I've seen this at work, previously as an operations mgr and DB expert at one of the larger aggregate firms....gotten paid well for maintaining it.
    I don't do it anymore...but that doesn't make it less so.

    They are collecting info on you. Each & Every company. And sharing it.

    Do we need to wait until there is proof of abuse...before setting some framing about it???
    I'm not one for over regulation...but it does seem to directly contradict one of the points of the US Constitution. (4th Amendment)
    But not really... Link
    Should there be some legal expectation and right to privacy??

    Frankly, I think that sites and otherwise should ask your distinct permission before tracking info.
    Just the reading or use of the site shouldn't be implicit.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2014
  7. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    Location:
    Temasek
    Here's the thing about data, most people give up their data willingly.

    Provide a free app, register for a service, etc.

    The business I work for monetizes that data all the time.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    Location:
    Temasek
    [​IMG]
     
    • Like Like x 4
  9. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    @Charlatan that could also be interpreted as the obliviousness of those who are unaware of what they lost...
    typically the generation that grew-up immersed in it.

    A good example is the principles and dynamics shown in the movie, Gattaca (which IS coming...)

    We always see the battle of principles and mindset when new tech is introduced...a paradigm shift.

    For instance, in this article the NYT is questioning the use of drones...or at least the implications of them.
    The Limits of Armchair Warfare

    And in my viewpoint, I disagree with this...and it is ironic, the NYT a liberal bastion, is basically saying be wary of drones,
    because the one on one killing is important to show the cost of war. (so, let's allow people to go in harm's way, to show their bravery and war is bad)

    Here is where I've immersed into the tech, I don't see the worry. These are not nukes or clusterbombs.

    Listen, I know they mean well...but this is the equivalent of saying let's get rid of bullets
    and keep using swords because they show our bravery, skill and the gore shows the cost of fighting.

    In a liberal context, frankly...it would be "nice" to stop all war, attacks and fighting all together, period.
    But this ain't going to happen in this reality. (maybe a couple of centuries later...if we haven't killed ourselves)

    True...you DO want to keep a restraint on the use of this. Just like you should with guns ...or chemicals ...or cars ...or drugs ...or food
    or ANY item or object that has the potential to kill or harm.
    There is a balance.

    This is why we have court systems and debate in the halls of government...and in the media.
    It's all situational...like you say in "context".
    It all ain't black & white...hell it is not even shades of grey, but a rainbow...or sometimes it's the full spectrum...and it's moving.

    So I say, if the President wants to see the insides of my ass. (re: the comic above)
    Well here it is. :p
    Just be careful with the info and what you're doing there...and ask me who you give it to.

    Dammit, there are guidelines and privileges to getting into my butt.
    Pretty damn well should be for everything.
    Yep, I know that's hard...but I ain't easy. ;)
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2014
  10. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    That needs to be the debate though when it comes to data and privacy. Effective governments need to know information, statistics, and trends. Humans pushing paper is only so effective, computers (who don't care about you or other individuals) are much better. Some data is out there for the public to see, but it really is the media/Internet mob/lawyers who would use the information against you. It wasn't Obama who told the NSA to expose any wealthy racists by recording their phone calls or bugging their homes... although I'm sure that is one conspiracy theory for what happened to Donald Sterling.

    The problem is the misuse of data. And those regulations are lacking. The libertarians are assuming that things are already happening or will happen inevitably. Will the government use the data to gerrymander congressional districts? Will they use it to increase taxes on certain unhealthy people? Will kids who have a high probability of getting a disease later in life because of their DNA have to pay more for health insurance? Should the government have fingerprints and/or DNA in a big database, and how will the court system use that data if there is no other evidence that you committed the crime? Or will they be able to solve more crimes and make it so people don't get away with rape and murder? Will terrorists be able to blend in with the paranoid libertarians and get training for how to plan attacks using encrypted and other communication techniques? Are the terrorists not a problem anymore or should we just play defense and be able to catch any of them in the act? What should the media be able to use? What personal details or information should they be able to tell people about? Should their be a different set of rules for public officials?
     
  11. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    Location:
    Temasek
    Absolutely there needs to be an overhaul, or at least a fresh take on privacy laws. Technology has reached levels where information can be collected and mined at levels the framers of the original laws couldn't conceive.

    On the other side of things, we do give away a tonne of our personal data for free, all the time. Much needs to be done to let general public understand the value of that data. To be clear, the value of that data in cash. Most people don't mind giving away a certain amount of information in return for a service, especially if that service will provide them with a personalized service. What they don't know is that their data has been packaged and sold off to other businesses looking to profile demographics, search for trends, etc.

    I don't think most people have a clue of the value of that data. They are giving it up for shiny beads.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    I agree with this article wholeheartedly...but not to the extent of a collapse...but it IS glutted, corrupt and inefficient.
    America is the biggest player...but we have gone "Jabba The Hut".
    The US military needs to be sleek and flexible. (Nukes have changed the game, there's no need for 2-front global wars.)

    And in turn, other players need to start investing in their own military again or more so...the US cannot be the world-policeman.
    They don't want the US over-involved and dictating...and the US is weary and cannot be everywhere.
    Nor should the American taxpayers be paying for support or influence for the whole world...or at least attempting to.
    Again, we don't want it and you don't want it. (only people neo-con industrialists like Cheney want it, a small but influential fraction)

    I'm sure the US also thinks influence & control is nice to a certain extent...but there is a unwieldy cost to that
    at many different levels.

     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2014
  13. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Back to the still building Big Data - Big Brother issue...
    We have a few points as our privacy quickly diminishes.

    Retailers Use Big Data to Turn You Into a Big Spender
    I've been involve with this myself, ops mgr at one of the big 3 of data aggregate companies. It IS happening.

    The Big Data Dump: How Info-Hoarding Can Overwhelm Startups, Spy Agencies
    This has long been a problem of bureaucracies, they do not want to let go of anything... (keeps me in a job)

    Big Brother: Meet the Parents
    Again, I've seen this myself from the inside...schools are data mining for the parents...as well as their analysis.

    We are seeing here a whole new paradigm shift.
    Just like we had to learn to manage nuclear material.
    And we're starting to debate make laws for cloning and other genetic manipulations
    We are seeing the need for limits on gathering of data.

    Each has the potential to be used...each has the potential of being abused.

    And the problem is...they are hidden and abstract...making it difficult for many to comprehend the threat, including our leaders.
    A gun you can see & touch. The blood you can see & touch.
    These you won't know the damage until it's too late...IF it's not managed correctly.

    And it's not just government we have to worry about with Big Data...it's corporations too, especially the big & powerful ones.
    Yes, it's nice to make money. I enjoy the paycheck too.
    What's the price we want to pay?? The transparency we allow??

    The data & open view is about...not on govt, not on corps
    but on us...
     
  14. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    I don't care that they are collecting the data, I care about how the data is being used. And that is the tricky part. If you want to use data to know who to advertise to and who is in the market for your product, that is one use. If we want to gerrymander congressional districts based on income, party affiliation, campaign sign and bumper sticker freq, that is something else. If the NSA wants to know if I am talking to terrorists or people who are helping terrorists, I am fine with that. If they are trying to figure out what is going on in the Ukraine that isn't being said in public, I'm fine with that too. If they want to make a list of who called supporters of environmental groups or a political party headquarters, then it might be a little too far. I don't care that my county puts every home owner's name on the GIS website they run, but I would start to care if the media started using that data and broadcasting it.
     
  15. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    What they are doing is creating personality profiles.
     
  16. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    And now for a positive note... (at least for the greens)
    Buffett is doubling-down on green energy.

    To quote Biden...This is a big fuckin' deal.
    And it may be a game changer.

    The fact that Warren Buffett is investing even more into renewable energy is significant.
    His method is to purchase that which is or will be a ubiquitous commodity...something used everyday by everyone...and for decades.

    Wind has shown itself to be stable...and now solar panels have become efficient enough and cheap enough to make it very viable.
    The fact that the unit itself combines "old-school" and new will help keep it profitable and build the momentum, paying for itself.
    Supporting the transition...diverse investment in the unit itself, not all the eggs in one basket.
    This will also help defend against opposition agendas, who want to keep "old-school" going and entrenched.

    I think we'll see a big shift within a 10 to 20 year period...not likely that Buffett will be around that long, I hope so though.
    but this allows his company to start investing into future growth ventures...keeping the company moving and stable after him.
    Plus he loves a great used cigar found on the ground...something someone else has ignored that's still useful.

    I know I'll be watching...between him & Musk...the scene is getting exciting...and doable.

     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  17. loquitur

    loquitur Getting Tilted

  18. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Actually, I just heard from my cousin today, he's a HS math teacher, that Virginia has sent out a memo stating they have "at will" rights.
    Meaning they can fire/layoff for most any reason with only 2 week notice.
    (only the classic race, creed, etc that is illegal can prevent it...then you have to prove it)

    Those with pensions can be tossed right before they reach a threshold.

    Also that they have the right to place you in any role they deem appropriate for their purposes.
    So a math teacher can be a different type or even non-academic.
    And vice versa, he upcoming new role of IT education SME, he can be thrown back into teaching at any time. (and he's burnt-out on it)

    hmm...you think it's hard to get and keep teachers now??
    But...it's as I predicted over a decade ago...everything will go online to reduce wages & costs.
    Is this better? No, classroom teaching is better...but the govt powers that be are cheap ass-hats.

    Teaching will change just like Manufacturing has.
    I'd say doctors are next...
     
  19. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    There are still unions left in the U.S.?
     
  20. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Yep - (yes, I know it's rhetorical) and in some cases they're doing lots of good...and in others they're going overboard and being selfish.
    It's when they go overboard that they get pounded.

    Same problem as with anything else, once they are established, they become focused on their own existence and influence, a conflict of interest.
    While they may have good leadership keeping the reins on at one time...sooner or later, bad leaders come in...and then they're bloated.
    Unions
    Polititicans
    CEO and Boards
    and so on...

    Power corrupts...if not now...then later.

    Their problem is when they trip...there's a big group (ex: GOP) that wants to kill them.