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Parental Shaming

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by cynthetiq, May 21, 2013.

  1. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    This is one of the many kinds of articles coming around these days of parents publicly shaming their kids in some fashion. Do you agree with this kind of discipline?

    Personally, there is no shame anymore. No one ever gets to feel bad because everyone passes, we've removed just about everything that makes someone uncomfortable in some fashion. This is of course, outside of the constructs. We can create guidelines and constructions as to how behavior is supposed to happen, it doesn't mean that kids will follow. Same goes for adults.

    Personally, I think that it's the last straw of the parent. I see it as a desperate attempt for the parent because they haven't consistently handed out even discipline. I agree with it to some degree because a punishment for kids is only as good a deterrent if it actually stops the behavior that is offensive. If it doesn't then the punishment is not good enough.
     
  2. I think this is terrible. In fact, it reinforces the girl's belief that there is something wrong with thrift store clothing and the people who wear them. The mother has created a class system society where she shames the lower class. It is difficult to draw any conclusions from such a short article but I'll bet the parenting has been poor and this isn't an isolated instance. The young girl is today what she has learned.
     
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  3. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    I get what you are saying. I didn't think of it that way initially as my wife had no choice but to wear poor box clothes. I didn't wear labels as a kid, wasn't really allowed nor was it purchased for me as a youngster. Teen years, I ended up going to the thrift store because it was cheap and I found good styles. I also never cared what people said about me.

    Mom Forces Daughter To Wear Thrift Store Clothes To Cure Her Of Bullying - MamaPop


    View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HPkMZWdvr4


     
  4. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    I'm not for it.

    Shaming, like other forms of negative reinforcement, can have a long-term detrimental impact on those who are still in their formative years (i.e., minors). It may teach them, whether they are conscious of it or not, that humiliating others can get them to do what you want.

    It's part of the reason why I'm against physical punishment.

    Shaming is an assault on someone's integrity of social values. It's not quite the same as guilt, which is an internal thing. With this in mind, I don't think shaming has the intended effect that most would think. I don't think shaming gets people to feel remorse or personal regret very much. It's not that the shame is coming from the shamed in this instance. It's being inflicted on them by someone else.

    I think this kind of shaming of children as punishment is far more punishing than disciplinary.
     
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  5. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Frankly, all it does is create resentment.
     
  6. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    doesn't all punishment create resentment?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. the_jazz

    the_jazz Accused old lady puncher

    There comes a point where the most effective way to communicate a sense of compassion is to force someone into an unfamiliar situation.

    Do I think that this would work for every kid? Of course not. Do I think that it would be very effective to help some kids. Absolutely. A more effective method might have been to have her volunteer to help the poor/homeless/hungry, but this concept seems specifically designed to address one exact issue and set of comments. I don't see how it teaches the kid that "thrift store stuff is bad". I actually think it's the opposite - that thrift store clothes are not the end of the world.

    And at least the parents are addressing the issue. A lot would ignore it after a single sit-down with the kid, if that much.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
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  8. Strange Famous

    Strange Famous it depends on who is looking...

    Location:
    Ipswich, UK
    Personally I would consider this relatively abusive. It is probably better and safer for social services to get involved and get this kid taken into care before this parents bullying gets out of hand and somebody really gets hurt.

    It might seem a bit better than hitting someone to do this, but what do you teach a kid through this sort of stuff other than "I am stronger you, physically and financially, therefore I can humiliate you in public and make a laughing stock of you if I want to". Oh yeah, and by the way I'm, going to put it on TV, which will humiliate you even more, but I am such an attention whore I dont care what effect this has on my child's emotional health because I'm going to be on TV. The parent involved here just strikes me as unfit. I am not sure if criminal charges could be brought or not, but just get the kid out of there.

    If my parents did this to me, I'd probably not take it very well.
     
  9. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    It just seems to me that the headline should read, "Bully mom bullies bully daughter as punishment for bullying."
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    why is she bullying the child? She sat down with the child and felt that the child did not learn, had no compassion, nor remorse for her actions.
     
  11. This.

    I'm not going to sit here and say that I think that this was the most effective means of teaching the child, or even that I know what that most effective means would be. However, I think that putting the child into the shoes of another is one of the best ways to get them to learn about what that child could be going through. It could possibly be that the child just didn't know what it's like, hasn't developed that theory of mind yet.

    Honestly, I find this kind of creative. It's a change from the stereotypical 'grounding' of children that sometimes really doesn't seem to work anymore; they've always got other things that they could be doing (grounded from the computer? I have my phone instead. Grounded from my computer and my phone? I'll go over to my friend's house and use their computer/phone/whatever).

    And like the_jazz said, at least the parents are doing *something.*
     
  12. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    That's a good question. Maybe she's bullying the child as a last resort? I know parents can resort to that sort of thing when the more noble options fail.

    I haven't read enough about this story to know just how many options she exhausted before going that route.
     
  13. On the other hand I don't think her parents did enough earlier in her life. And now she is a bully. Dressing her up in thrift store clothing does nothing to unravel why the girl felt compelled to do what she did. We'll ever know but I'll bet whatever is the source for this will manifest itself again. I doubt if this is a life changing event for the girl.
     
  14. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Only going by the OP

    there are lengthier posts with more dialog from the parent.

    --- merged: May 21, 2013 at 7:06 PM ---
    What is a bully? Once you do 1 bully act you're a bully 4 life?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 28, 2013
  15. Well after reading what cynthetiq posted maybe I am wrong. I hope I am.
     
  16. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    With that lengthier bit you quoted, it's interesting to contrast what the pros say with the supposed outcome of the parent-child interaction in this case.

    To me, it would seem it's a demonstration that bullying works, especially if orchestrated by a resourceful authority figure such as a parent.

    I mean, maybe the kid learned her lesson. Maybe she learned that teasing is mean. Maybe she will be kinder to her peers.

    But maybe she's simply toeing the line to avoid further humiliation. Because, you know, thrift clothing really sucks.
     
  17. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Isn't that anything like the Penal systems? I mean there's humiliation for some, others not so much.

    Is grounding a child bullying? Is forcing them to do chores bullying?
     
  18. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    The "correctional" system is filled with humiliation, yes, which is another reason why I think the idea of parental shaming is repugnant. What a thing to be compared to when parenting your children.

    Bullying can take the form of coercion, but it usually has a component of abuse or intimidation. In this case, the kid was coerced into a situation with a high likelihood of being subject to verbal abuse and shame. Actually, it was probably expected and hoped for from the parents' perspective. Otherwise, how would it be effective enough?

    This is fundamentally different from being grounded or having to do chores.
     
  19. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia ...

    Location:
    Florida
    I really don't see how this is bullying on the part of the parent. I swear, sometimes it seems like parents are wrong regardless of what they do. She wore some clothes to school for a couple of days that weren't as stylish as her normal clothes. Oh boo hoo. How will she ever go on?

    Once again, this is a classic example of people sticking their noses where they don't belong. This is not newsworthy
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
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  20. Good point.