Unwanted sexual attention in the US?

Equality is not a zero-sum game and this is nothing more than a string of false equivalencies. Men and women are different; that doesn't mean that everything balances out.

Her article offers a really basic solution: consider the cultural and societal context of your actions. In our context, you are in a position of power and authority by virtue of being a man. Women do not have that power and authority. It's not right but that's the way it is at this time. If you don't think it's right, don't abuse that power and that authority. If you act in an aggressive way without expecting consequences, you are abusing that power and authority.

 

I have been through this with my middle son, broken noses and heroin addiction. He has 14months clean for the first time in four years.
Sounds like your son has the best support system a man can have, I agree totally with Zen.

 

While I agree with much of your post, I'll need to think long and hard about the above comment. It doesn't feel true to me and doesn't match my experience - which is not to deny that is true for some men/women. However, as a general truth, I'm less sure. Some matriarchal families I have known come to mind, in which the matriarch would likely scoff at the suggestion.

I think there are many types and sources of both power and authority. I also think that power is something we generally give to others (as opposed to something they have innately).

Maybe this is cultural? Could you perhaps explain why you feel this is true? Maybe I'm getting hung up on semantics or taking the comment out of context.
--- merged: Jan 4, 2013 at 9:55 PM ---

Thanks Freetofly - and Zen! That's great news about your son! You must be very happy. My son has been clean for nearly a year now and I'm very optimistic about the future, as I am sure you are

 

I've gotta do more than click 'like'. I first saw Phaedra's article when it was cited on the old TFP (by Poetry? ). It blew me away and was a breath of fresh air. It totally clicked. Your words add light to my intial reaction. Thank you, MSD

 

This is the main reason I posted that article, it totally blew me away. I work in public mass transit and I read that article regularly and post and re-post it regularly. I find it very helpful to understand another way of thinking.

 

Ahhhhhhh! Yes! It was YOU. Now I remember. I think Poetry might have done a post on your thread. But Yes. I remember it was you, and doing so, made a dang big difference to my life. Thanks.

 

Just read that article. Amazing. A great perspective on those who don't understand why women are so protective of themselves and can come off as almost cold and paranoid. As someone who was assaulted by someone I knew and was close to, I really appreciated how it emphasized the fact that there can never be a 100% guarantee of safety, no matter how nice and polite you view yourself to be. Thanks for bringing it to my attention, you guys. Definitely went in my favorites folder and will be brought out many times.

 

I really want to thank Lucifer and, especially, MSD for stepping out in this thread. It's really not all that complicated. All it takes is a little abandonment of expectations and a little empathy. No one wants you to change, especially, if you're a 'good guy.' We just want you to understand the consequences that women, as a whole, have had dealing with so many bad ones. It's the ones who can transcend and understand that I, personally, think of as really, *really* good men. And I have met precious few. Sorry, if that offends. But it's true. And I'm sure it's true of women, too. There's precious few.

 

I can relate to this. I never thought I would.
Love to you, snowy. These things we can't control. You just have to let go.

 

Western culture is patriarchal. As men, we don't notice the existence and prevalence of male privilege unless we educate ourselves on what it is and why it exists, then actively look for it. It's not something we notice, it just seems like business as usual for us.

As far as US politics, it's newsworthy when we have more women in congress than ever before; it's a big deal that Hillary Clinton was a front runner for her party's presidential nomination; nominating women to the supreme court and at least trying not to have fewer women on the court than previously are big deals. Men are the default for those positions, women are underrepresented. That's business as usual.

In day-to-day life, men are assumed to be the heads of household, they're assumed to be the ones to make major decisions, they're the ones who provide while women are provided for. Mail to a couple comes addressed to "Mr. and Mrs." not the other way around (this pretty innocuous, but it's a convention that exists because our society is patriarchal.) Walk into a car dealership with your wife and 9 times out of 10, the salesman is going to look at you and shake your hand first. You wouldn't give it a second thought and neither would the salesman because society assumes that you are the one who will make the final decision and sign the papers.

In day-to-day life, look for it. Look at how cashiers and customer service reps treat men compared to how they treat women. When men and women are together, look at how people talk to them and who they talk to first in various circumstances. Once you start seeing it, you see it everywhere.

You're welcome. As a white heterosexual male in a rich town, it took a long time to understand the concept of privilege ("I'm not racist, sexist, or homophobic, what more do you want from me?") and see the bigger picture, which is why I'm so vocal about it.

 

MSD - thanks for that. I would certainly agree that the playing field is still not level and that men generally enjoy a favoured position in many important aspects of life. I thought you were driving at something else with your "power and authority" references and can see now that maybe I misunderstood what you meant (those words have complex connotations for me in the context of group and interpersonal relationships). Thanks for the clarification.

 

A friend just posted this on Facebook and I wanted to share.

 

Honestly - most men I know are offended by those claims. I've heard them said, but anyone who comes out with them is normally challenged on them.

 

Then you know some great people, Alistair.

 

Don't misunderstand me, though. I would absolutely advise my daughter (when she was younger) about how to avoid trouble, just as I did my son.

That is simple risk mitigation.

Unfortunately, there are bad people out there and sometimes it is simply not advisable to dress or act a certain way in a certain bar or neighbourhood (just as it is a bad idea to walk around with a large wad of cash in open sight in an area known for muggings).

That isn't blaming the woman. That's just passing on street wisdom. I don't think I ever asked her to dress differently, though. Mind you, young women dress somewhat more outrageously here than they do over there anyway, so blending in was never an issue!

 

I'm just happy that you know people who don't exclusively blame the victim, I unfortunately know more than I would like. I grew up in the Detroit area, and actually lived Downtown for a point in time, as well as attend school there now. I am extremely familiar with not walking around looking like you have something to steal, and I hate it just as much as making sure my coat is zipped all the way up or something is covering my backside. I have common sense when it comes to dressing and location at certain points in time in certain areas, it's just sad that so much is needed.

 

Thank You,
I have appreciated this whole conversation.

I have read every entry, opinion and found merit or enlightenment in each.

You have helped me put into perspective events, (while shoving them back into the carry on bag, that somehow had slipped out of that figurative Bus Locker and started following me around again)...
Crap that I thought was behind me.

For every sad story there is a worse one out there. The atrocities humans can commit against each other are varied and inventive.

Yes I have stories. Things that I would never wish on any little girl or woman have happened.
But, I want to be the person who learns and moves beyond that moment.
Life has taught me that both the people who were suppose to love and protect me and those who vowed to love and cherish me have lied, being no better than the veritable one who broke in through the window in the middle of the night. The stranger who made no promises except those he whispered in my ear.

I have done more than just survive. I take what I am and will myself to learn and thrive.

I search for whatever it is I have to do, for myself, so that I do not feel afraid, stupid, naive... or any other demeaning description that might pop up.
If I don't, I might as well stop... just stop. Because I wouldn't be able to live anymore.

I truly believe, It is not always what has happened, but what are you going to do now?

I have realized that the really scary people (mostly but not always men) are the ones who appear normal, nice like good sociopaths can pretend to be.
And if some "Man" who say's he wishes to pursue a 'relationship' of any sort with me is offended by what I do to be able to feel comfortable meeting them... Well Screw Him anyway!
I have learned to not give everyone a break, until they prove otherwise. If I had continued to do that, I would be dead already.
I do own a gun and know how to use it and care for it, as well as a female dog.
I hunt and hike also. So the gun is not just for Men...
There are other scary carnivores out in the world too. Pepper spray in not always sufficient.

I look, observe and have learned that those things I "know" are micro observation that I can't prove yet and to listen to my gut not their sales pitch.
I won't be barricaded within my house waiting for another assault. I have taught myself to look out for myself and not do stupid things... I will not be that female (usually near naked) in the horror movie who opens the door and says "Is someone there". The one who goes to her car alone in the dark without looking around.. or finding a security guard, even if it's embarrassing and time consuming.

I will venture out and let the parts of me, that I like out.
That Women who walks down the street smiling, just for the sake of smiling.
Who drives cross country by herself to visit a friend.
Who will go to a movie alone or a Blues concert without the safety of a bodyguard, when none are available.
Because it feels good to laugh, breath the air and be part of the world.

It feels better than just being alive.

 

kind of nauseating, that.